Interview: “We Want This Show to Be a Beacon for Change': Tom Ling, Nick Butcher & Joe White Talk Representation, Collaboration and Joy in THE LITTLE BIG THINGS

Created by a young team of exciting theatre makers, new musical The Little Big Things has music by Nick Butcher, lyrics by Nick Butcher and Tom Ling and a book by Joe White. 

Based on Henry Fraser's best-selling memoir: The Little Big Things, Nick, Tom and Joe sat down for a chat with BroadwayWorld where they spoke of their hope that the new musical will be a beacon change in terms of authentic representation of disability, the stories told on the West End and celebrate the love of their cast and creative team.

The Little Big Things is based on a true story – can you tell us a little bit about the piece and what drew you to it as creatives?

Nick: I’d been an actor for the last ten years, and was performing in a West End musical, and knew that I wanted to be a songwriter, and at some point I was going to transition from working as a performer to wanting to write shows. I put out a tweet and said I was looking for someone to write lyrics with, and Tom replied to that tweet, all by happenstance. We met up and got on really well, and wrote some songs. But of course, you need a great story. Again, pure coincidence, I was living with a friend whose boyfriend at the time was a Saracens rugby player, who said I should read this book called The Little Big Things…"

Joe: He played rugby with Henry’s brother.

Nick: Absolutely, so he knew the Fraser family and said I should read this autobiography, I did and instantly thought it would be a fantastic musical – it’s a story with so much heart, about family and a story that I don’t think we’ve seen theatrically before so something that could maybe, shift the needle in terms of the stories that are predominantly told on the West End, and we thought: ok, this could really be something! At that point, I wrote Henry a letter and he invited us to his home. Tom and I went round and basically told him what we thought The Little Big Things could be, and he basically trusted us: said yes, I’ll give you the rights for a little bit, go away and write some songs. That’s exactly what we did, we wrote two demo songs… but a good musical relies so heavily on its book,  so we needed a great playwright and that’s where Joe comes in!

Joe: I’d written a play which was on at the Orange Tree theatre (Mayfly) and again it was just happenstance, great timing: Nick saw it and liked it; similarly it was also about a family who go through a trauma, and them understanding their new family unit and healing together; I think that’s what drew Nick to me for The Little Big Things. We had a chat, I heard these two songs and was completely blown away… couldn’t stop singing them, to an annoying degree (1am, 2am, lying in bed with them in my head!) and just thought: I have to do this. I was doing a lot of work with Graeae at the time, and Nickie Miles- Wilden, an associate there and we had a big conversation about doing this, and doing it authentically, the right way, with all the right people on board; making sure it was all about me helping to tell Henry’s story; giving him and this book a theatrical language… that was my one job. I met Henry, he gave his blessing, and then Nick, Tom and I went away together on a writing retreat in Connecticut for the Johnny Mercer Foundation: two weeks solidly, writing every single day and we came away from that with a full draft: 12- 14 songs and were ready to go: in February 2020…We went away, writing, rewriting and Henry was so great at the back and forth with ideas, and so excited that his life is going to be a musical; and we’re blessed with an incredibly collaborative, inclusive creative team; lots of learning, lots of listening, and it’s been an amazing thing.

Leading on from that, what are some of the challenges and joys of adapting a true story for the stage; is it difficult to choose what aspects you want to focus on?

Tom: It’s interesting, because when you read this story: there’s so many emotional highs and lows, so actually it makes perfect sense to turn into a musical because as songwriters, that’s what you’re looking for: those moments when characters can no longer speak, so they have to sing. There’s a lot of those moments here, where the family are confronted with things they’ve never been through before, so they have to find a way through one way or another.

When we read it, I think we both could see 100% how it could work as a musical – the foundations were already there, as it’s Henry’s book and story – we’ve been lucky enough to meet him twice and then interviewed his mum, dad, his brothers, some of his mates. We also went to the hospital (Stoke Mandeville) who looked after and rehabilitated Henry when he returned from Portugal so he was able to get back out into the world. We compiled all those notes from those interviews, the people we met and crossed referenced that with the book and picked the bits that we thought were most prominent to the story that we wanted to tell, and the themes we wanted to focus on.

It's incredible, the people he has touched in his life; so many people we spoke with felt such a strong, personal connection to Henry and his story, it was really remarkable seeing how this one person had impacted so many lives!

Nick: Just on the lyrical aspect, some of our phrases are taken directly from Henry’s book; our job is to facilitate his story. He talks about “the silence of the sea”, and that is a big number for us in Act 2 where he revisits the accident and that phrase was like gold dust for us, but it wasn’t just the autobiography we took from.

Meeting the family, we were able to go deeper, and tell parts of this story that aren’t in the autobiography. For example, meeting Fran (Henry’s Mum), she talked about the moment she heard the news, she screamed and broke down, the opposite of the father who was silent at the time – his emotional journey was different to hers. She said in that moment, she just saw his life flash before her eyes and she talked us through what Henry was like as individual through every year of his life, up until the age of 17. So, we created this song for Fran, played by Linzi Hateley, called “One to Seventeen” – it’s a memory song, she stops in time and revisits every year of Henry’s life… it’s an emotional one to watch, but that came directly from interviewing her. I guess that’s the difference with a real life story: being able to speak with your characters in go deeper in a way that you might not necessarily if it weren’t.

Joe: I’d say every dramatic choice we’ve made has been informed by reality, either from the book or interviews, and that’s why I think we’ve all had confidence to write this, because it’s founded in Henry and his family’s authenticity. 

How have you been able to approach disability and disabled performers on stage? What have you had to adapt to incorporate this realistically into the show?

Joe: Another great question! I think, from the very beginning of doing this story, we thought about it authentically, inclusively, and with the fullest room as possible, so that from the creative team through to the casting, it has always been about including artists with disabilities. We’re very lucky to be in the most incredible space to hold this story – it probably couldn’t exist in any other theatre in London right now – its bespoke built to be accessible. So, in terms of conversations about the West End, we never had to have any because @sohoplace is here and ready!

From a storytelling aspect, it’s really a story about disabled joy so conversations with Henry were really important and having him as a soundboard for ideas, and having Nickie come on as dramaturg and associate director and talking about representation has been a really big thing. Henry is an inspirational guy, but we’ve moved away from what Nickie calls “inspiration porn” and it being that story and really it’s a story about a family in trauma learning to accept and adapt, learning about the social model of disability – that a person is only as disabled as society makes them, and breaking down those barriers; having those conversations and listening.

It’s about celebration, too: I’m so excited that this will be the West End’s first musical with a protagonist who is a wheelchair-using artist; the disabled characters get some absolute belters, some great jokes, and the character work going on are some of my proudest moments.  It’s been a joy working with Mark in choreography, every aspect of this has been looked at with the most inclusive team we can have, and it’s about sharing that, isn’t it?

Nick: It’s also about the practical elements, our producers have been incredibly supportive – making sure that our rehearsal rooms are accessible, that our recording studios are accessible, that every aspect of this show relinquishes any barrier that might have been put up in the past.

Joe: We want this show to be a beacon for change, it should be a demonstration of what can be done!

What about the music and lyrics – what’s the process been like and how would describe the sound and feel of this piece?

Nick: I call this piece theatrical pop – it’s got storytelling at its heart and that’s where the songs come from, but we try to ground them in a place that feels contemporary. Something, that you can lock onto; when you reach a chorus, you’re at a home sound: something you recognise. That’s really important to me, just in terms of musical structure.

Tom: I think, even from when we first met, you know, after that tweet, we both had the same vision with the music that we wanted to write – songs that were true to the story but were influenced by pop and had that commercial aspect to them, that could reach those outside of the musical theatre world, and draw them into Henry's story.

Nick: Yeah! It came a lot from what Henry would have had on his iPod and been listening to at the time of the accident, and when he was spending a lot of time in hospital, what would have been the soundtrack to his life at that moment – and then making that as theatrical as possible.

Have you had a favourite moment – musically, lyrically or story wise that you’re particularly excited about audiences seeing?

Joe:  I can’t wait to have an audience, being present, and then having that disabled joy of the protagonist being a wheelchair using artist, and saying we’re presenting this story to you, and that first moment when they realise what they are in for! That opening number, when people look around and think: this is something exciting…

Tom: It’s so exciting as writers, to have a director like Luke (Sheppard) come onto the scene because he just does things that surprise us in the room. There’s been so many moments where we think we know where its going (we’ve written it, after all) and then he’ll do something with the direction and you’ll feel the room… take it in, take a moment!

Joe: He did something in the room a few days ago, in a moment between a few characters - a tiny gesture, just changed and where someone was placed and the whole room gasped and broke into tears. It’s an alchemy, and one of those things where you go: that’s why we do it, why we’re here and present for it, because you get to witness, every now and then: a bit of magic.

Nick: For me, it’s about the integration of the songs in the show; because I think, on the surface, you can listen to them and (hopefully!) say these are good songs, but in their context in the show they take on a whole new meaning emotionally and I can’t wait for people to come, having the tunes in their head, and experience them as part of Henry’s story.

Henry is also an incredible painter. How important was it to include this in the show?

Joe: Massively – the show’s aesthetic, it’s visuals are all about a story being filled in: of paint, of colour being brought into someone’s life – it’s about his self discovery, finding yourself and learning how to express yourself.

Nick: You’ll start seeing our poster campaign painting the West End in colour over the coming weeks, and that’s really exciting!

A new musical opening in London’s newest theatre is incredibly exciting; how does that journey start and for you as creatives, why is new work so important to the industry?

Nick: So when initial discussions about Nica Burns’ brand new theatre that was accessible were happening, the show started to fit like a glove into the space, and we started to think as a creative team: “what might the show look like in this space” and that really helps the writing process, the design process, the sound, everything leans into that."

Joe: Exactly – it’s a musical in the round! When we first started working on this, I don’t think anyone imagined a space for it, but especially not in the round. This takes on an adaption of its own sort: thinking about where sound is placed, how we’re seen, how sound and visuals move in those spaces. It’s a challenge, but a really exciting challenge. Going to the question about new work, for me as a playwright, it’s everything! It’s the lifeblood of theatre – without new stories, we have no idea who we are anymore… if we tell old stories over & over again that’s all we’re ever going to understand. We have to move forward and understand ourselves better and the way we do that is through stories.

The cast for the show includes Alasdair Harvey, Linzi Hateley, Cleve September and Malinda Parris – how does it feel seeing your piece come alive with the people in the room? Does it also give you a sense of what works and what perhaps could work better?

Joe: Absolutely- as a new piece of work, it’s always changing and you’re constantly learning, and this cast and company are second to none: reacting, giving and collaborating. They are so up for it, and care about it so much – as much as we do, maybe more! It really matters to them, so we try and consider everyone’s thoughts. Everyone thinks very deeply about this show… the best bit is when you hand over your work, to somebody – your baby, and they don’t only deliver on what you expect, but they change the way you felt it could be. They teach you about your own characters, and that’s happened here across the board.

Nick: Building a new musical takes an army of people who come and go over a period of time, and only get to this point by people giving so much of their love and energy, and they might, for whatever reason not end up in the first production, but may have done a workshop or a demo recording… it’s the collectiveness of everyone’s love on a project that creates something as special as I hope The Little Big Things is.

Describe the show in three words!

Tom: Shall we do one each?

Nick: I’ll go theatrical.

Joe: I’m gonna say family.

Tom: Joy.

The Little Big Things runs @sohoplace until 25 November. Stream the soundtrack here.