BWW Interviews: THE WOMAN IN BLACK Director Robin Herford

First of all, congratulations on such a long run of The Woman in Black at the Fortune Theatre!

Thank you very much. Yes, 20 years. Who could have guessed?

And in the West End too. I suppose you couldn't have hoped for that when you started.

Yes. I wanted it to run for three and a half weeks in a 70-seater theatre in Scarborough.

Really?

Absolutely. It did fine there. It sold out immediately. We put in midnight matinees and other scary things. They sold out. So we thought, well, this is all right. But that's in Scarborough and it was at Christmas time and people like to have a bit of a giggle at Christmas time. Maybe that's it. But let's just try it. I spent the next year knocking on doors, sending scripts to producers. I got some quite good rejection slips! Stephen Mallatratt, who did the adaptation, and I knew this man, Peter Wilson, who's a producer, and he took a punt on this show. He hadn't seen it being done in Scarborough, but he read the script and said, "I know Stephen, I know you, let's give it a go."

A year later - it took a whole year - we got a production on at the Lyric Hammersmith with Charles Kaye and John Duttine. That was 1989, and we opened in January to some very nice reviews, which was lovely, which enabled us to transfer into the West End. We ran for six weeks at the Strand, which is now the Novello. Then we got kicked out of that and we went to the Playhouse, where we were doing terrible business. We got kicked out of that and I thought, "Well, that's it."

Then we landed this place, the Fortune, which only seats 400 people. It was the theatre we wanted in the first place because it is so intimate. From a purely financial point of view, there aren't many shows that are financially viable in this small theatre. If you've got a cast of six or eight, there's a wage bill that needs paying and there are only 400 seats to pay for it. If you've only got two people in the cast, it makes it much more attractive. There is set, but not a lot of difficult set. There's no flying, there's no moving elements. We rely on the skill of the actors and the imagination of the audience and a terrific story, which Susan Hill provided. She wrote the novel about seven years before we finally put it on. It's a terrific story, and Stephen has provided this wonderful adaptation, which takes on and enhances the premise of Susan's novel.

People don't expect to be scared in the theatre, they really don't. When you think of the special effects you can provide on screen, you think, "What on earth is there that's going to scare me in a theatre?" They've made their first mistake. One of the reasons is that it's not just what happens on the stage. The whole of the theatre, including the auditorium, is the set. So actors don't only appear on the stage, and you can't actually sit comfortably in your seat for very long.

As you say, people don't expect to be scared at the theatre, but they've been scared here for 20 years now.

People come back for two reasons. They were scared, and they want to bring other people to watch them jump. Our two biggest selling nights - we are always sold out on Hallowe'en, which is fair enough, I can understand that, but we're also fully sold out on Valentine's Day. Think about it. If you want to get to know someone a little better, you take them to see a scary show and hopefully they'll jump into your arms halfway through. There's always a terrific atmosphere on Valentine's night.

Do you get a lot of repeat business? Presumably once you've seen it once, it might not make you jump so much the next time, but you say people bring friends along too.

Yes, they do that, but they come for the acting as well. Because it's only a two-hander, there are only two guys in it, I can allow them to dictate how the show goes. I say, "Within reason this is your show for the next nine months, and I want you to feel happy about the choices you make." Obviously we'll talk about them. What is the point in employing highly intelligent, articulate, imaginative actors if you don't listen to what they have to suggest? And so you get very, very different interpretations. People say, "I saw Frank Finlay in it, and I saw Edward Petherbridge in it, and I saw Joe Fiennes in it." The roll-call of wonderful actors who've been in this show is extraordinary - not all of them big stars.

The one thing we are not short of in this country is wonderful character actors, many of whom the general public do not know by name. Stage acting is something we do in this country as well as anyone. We have this wonderful heritage of theatre and drama training and the wonderful plays we've got - not only Shakespeare, all sorts of wonderful gems. This play enables actors to show off, to give the audience a glimpse of what they can do. So people come and collect casts - "I saw so-and-so", "I want to see so-and-so", "Ooh, yes, I liked him in so-and-so, I'll come and see him in that." It's great. As it goes on, people bring their children, and the children bring their children. It's crazy, but over 20 years, generations move on.

You change the case every nine months - how many cast changes is that over 20 years?

It's not an exact science. Sometimes it's quicker than that, but never longer than that. It's quite a lot. I've also directed it abroad, so I've probably directed somewhere between 50 and 60 combinations, which is great. I get to work with these wonderful actors.

It must be a very different working dynamic to adapt to from cast to cast.

Yes, it is. Some are very joky, some are very intense and very serious. Getting the chemistry right between these two actors is hugely important. For nine months, for eight shows a week, you're married to this guy. You certainly will see more of this other actor than you do of your partner.

How do you go about getting that balance right when you're casting, then? Do you see them together or separately?

I see a lot of theatre. I try and collect actors. This isn't the only play I direct, I hasten to add - I'm working all over the country doing other shows. Quite often I'll say, "Oh, now, he'd be rather good." I keep my eye out for possibles.

Who's on the wishlist?

The wishlist! Ooh, no, that would be telling. If I were to mention that, immediately their agents would put their prices up. "He really wants you, you know, he really wants you, you can ask for another £500 a week!"

Are you allowed to have favourite casts?

Not really. People say, "How do you do this without getting bored? It's the same script." I do admit that the prospect of directing another cast is sometimes a bit daunting, and you think, "Oh, gosh, can I do it another time?" But then you find the two people and you put them together and you have a read-through. It's a big ask. Any two-hander is a big ask for an actor. So I get a glimpse of these two people at the foothills of their particular Everest. Then you've got three weeks to get to the top.

That generates enormous enthusiasm and energy. I love the company of actors. I just love it. I know that's a bit unfashionable to say. I'm not a conceptual director. No-one pays to see a director's show, they pay to see the actors, whether they know them or not. Those are the shock troops; they are the ones who, when the whistle blows, have to go over the top. It can be terrifying. Tonight [Monday June 8th] is a first night for the new cast. I've been rehearsing for the last three weeks with two new actors, Julian Forsyth and Christopher Naylor. Tonight they do it for the first time in front of an audience, which is terrifying, but really good too.

Do you still get excited about the first night with a new cast?

Absolutely. Absolutely. Their adrenaline communicates to me. And I think it communicates to the audience, though hardly anyone in the audience will know that it is a first night. Maybe their parents or their partners will be in the audience, but for the most part their friends stay away until they're settled in. And it's an extraordinarily steep learning curve. They did a dress rehearsal this afternoon, first show this evening, tomorrow afternoon a matinee, tomorrow evening another show. So by Tuesday night they'll have done four shows. They'll be in a very different place from where they are now.

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