Interview: James Fritz Talks THE FALL

Originally commissioned as part of the National Youth Theatre's 60th anniversary, The Fall is about generations and the differences and similarities between them. Somewhat appropriately, the show itself has brought together different generations of NYT.

As a new cast of students prepares to open the show at Southwark Playhouse, NYT alum and Olivier-nominated playwright James Fritz revisits the script. With rehearsals drawing to a close, James shares the journey of this show and why this is his favourite time of the process.

What was your first experience with theatre?

I grew up in Croydon and my mum used to take me to a place called the Warehouse Theatre. I have no memories of what I saw, but I have a real feeling of being there: the colour and the space and the experience of going with my mum. And that makes sense to me, because that's what it's all about; you don't always remember details of what it was, but how it affects you.

But the first proper play I saw was when I was about 15. It was Henry V with Adrian Lester at the National Theatre, and there were tanks and guns and cameras. That's all stuff which most people in that audience would have been used to. But I was so new to that world. I didn't know that you could make a play like that. That kind of opened my eyes to what theatre could be.

And did you always want to channel that passion for theatre into writing?

Well, I did a bit of acting first. I joined the National Youth Theatre, but quite young. Too young I think, looking back. At 15, I didn't really know what it was or what was expected of me. But it was an amazing experience.

So I got the bug from being in school plays and that, which is why I then chose to study it at university. It was there really that I started writing, sketches first really. And I had a couple of writer friends who encouraged me to do it.

And I remember it really clearly, that first time. I hadn't been in rehearsals, because I didn't know you were allowed to! So I showed up and saw what these other students had done with this thing that I'd handed in, and how different it was. And it was so exiting, I never forgot that really.

And I still get that feeling. So it was then that I started to think that might be the way that I could help make theatre... And I just really wanted to be involved! Like, I play in goal for my five-a-side team just so they'll let me play!

You mentioned just then not realising that you could go to rehearsals during university, even though you'd written the play. With rehearsals underway for your new play The Fall, what is your role at this point in the process?

Well, now I like to be in quite a lot! I think a big part of my job is being around the other people that are making the thing and bringing it to life. And being present enough and flexible enough to help them make it better.

And then at some point, round about now with The Fall, I will step away. I've seen it happen before where I've maybe meddled too much. A moment comes when it's really exciting to just be like, "Okay, the words are the words. Now do all this other stuff."

How did you first become involved with this project?

The National Youth Theatre asked me if I wanted to write a play for them. And I thought long and hard about what that commission means. What does it mean to write for only young bodies on stage?

And I didn't feel like I could tell their story. I'm a little bit older than them and they can do it, so why would they need me? So then I thought, "Okay, so if I'm not doing that but I have people under the age of 25, what is an idea of something I am interested in that would work with that form?" And then the idea came quite quickly to me.

So what idea and themes did you want to explore with The Fall?

For a while now, I've been really interested in how as a younger generation, we are heading towards a disaster in terms of adult social care. The shrinking of the welfare state vs. the increasing number of people over the age of 75.

And there's also this thing as well where at periods in history, old people are marginalised or their concerns fall way down the list of what's important to us. And the same thing tends to be happening to young people as well. We live in a society which is all focused around work and production, and that isn't the main purpose in the lives of those groups. By and large, they haven't started work yet or they've finished.

And there's this line between the young and the old, and that break in empathy which exists in the middle somewhere. We don't necessarily see the older people in our lives as us in an instant. But of course they are.

And how did you develop these ideas, when writing the first version for Finborough Theatre?

I did a week's R&D with a great bunch of NYT members, getting them to speak to their grandparents or the older people in their lives. I will admit, I was a bit jealous. My grandparents died when I was quite young. I was close to them when I was a kid, and I remember that feeling really strongly. I do miss having that connection to another generation.

On the first day, everyone was like, "I love my nan. She's not like other old people, she's really young at heart." And the second day, they'd got all of that out of the way. I'm really glad they did this and I pushed them to do it, because they talked quite openly and honestly about the things that they're afraid of about old age.

And a lot of them were talking about the "old people" as being like a different species of human. And that made me think loads. What have we done to put that empathy block in the way? And is that one of the main reasons why we're heading towards this crisis?

There's something programmed into us that doesn't want to think, "That's going to be me, or my mum, or my dad. I'll never get old." So being given all these full of life performers, it felt great to get them in a room and contemplate that with them. And that's where the idea of the play came from.

So after that R&D, how did these themes of youth and old age manifest themselves in the play?

The play is divided into three sections which bursts through 60-65 years of time, and the actors play people of all ages. And Matt Harrison's done a great job of really pushing them to embrace their youth, and what that does when they're playing a text that's all about ageing and dying. There's a real tension there.

So it interrogates their relationship to old people now, it interrogates what their relationship might be to their parents when they reach an old age, and it interrogates where they might end up as a society and individuals when they reach old age themselves.

And as much as this project is about the play, it's also important to me to connect these kids to their future selves and the people who got them here.

Talking future selves, you won the Critics' Circle Theatre Award for Most Promising Playwright early in your career. Did you feel any pressure after that win for your future plays?

Yes, loads. And it's kind of bollocks! "Promising playwright"...I find really odd. You haven't done anything yet! It's like they're hedging their bets!

Of course, it was really nice to be recognised for my first proper play, Four Minutes Twelve Seconds at Hampstead. And I brought my mum to the ceremony, and she sat behind Judi Dench and took a photo of the back of Judi Dench's head!

But a couple of years later, I find it all quite distracting from doing the work. I don't feel ungrateful for it at all, but it did make me feel pressure. I felt like I needed to write a play which did as well as that one.

Finally, on that note, what advice would you give to aspiring young writers?

Take your time. Don't rush too quickly into having one way of working. Think about what you want to say, and why you want to write. And actually, where I was when I won the award and where I am now in my career, I'm still working out what my job means.

And read loads and write loads. The people I know who are starting to do well, they're the people that work really hard. They're not afraid to throw things away and start again, and are not afraid to take criticism on board.

But above all, I think the main thing that I've learned and which has helped me is letting other people in. That's the best thing you can do. You're not writing a fixed piece of literature; you're writing something that other people need to be excited by and need to want to bring their voices to.

The Fall at Southwark Playhouse, 28 April-19 May

Photo credit: Joel C Fileds, Mark Cocksedge

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