Interview: The Creators of PAIN TO POWER: A KANYE WEST MUSICAL PROTEST

The question of ‘Can you separate the Art from the Artist’ is something many have had to wrestle with at one time or another. Social media has granted celebrities platforms that they unfortunately sometimes misuse – leading their fans to struggle not only with a sense of guilt for continuing to support their artistry, but often a sense of betrayal from someone who was once an idol or hero.

Seth Zosky and CJ Capital understand this pain all too well. They initially bonded over the music of Kanye West, and his music continued to inspire them as artists. Comments West has made and actions he has taken over the past several years have targeted communities that both Zosky and Capital are part of, making their one-time admiration of his music something that is now a source of pain.

While most folks either decide to abandon Art they once loved, or to consume it in spite of its creator, Zosky and Capital have discovered a powerful third option. In their fascinating project PAIN TO POWER: A Kanye West MUSICAL PROTEST, these two Artists reclaim the music that helped shape their craft by using it to express the hurt and betrayal they have felt due to the choices Kanye West has made.

After initially premiering the show last year at the Winnipeg Jewish Theatre, Zosky and Capital are now bringing an updated version to the Segal Centre in Montreal and then to EL MOCAMBO here in Toronto.

Broadway World had the opportunity to send Zosky and Capital some questions about this intriguing project and the two sent back the following responses:

BWW: To start, please tell me a little bit about yourselves, your friendship, and your personal relationships with Kanye West and his music.

Zosky & Capital: We’re Seth Zosky and CJ Capital, and we’ve been friends since we met in Sheridan’s Musical Theatre program in 2017. What connected us beyond theatre was our love for basketball, music, and, of course, Kanye West.

Kanye’s music was foundational for us. It shaped the way we understood artistry, creativity, and even ourselves. For CJ, growing up in a Haitian household filled with gospel and Caribbean music, discovering Kanye was like being introduced to an entirely new way of storytelling and sound. For Seth, as a performer & drummer raised on classic rock and folk, Kanye’s production and rhythms electrified his musical instincts. We both found something deeply personal in his work; it was bigger than just being a fan.

But that also meant when Kanye’s words and actions took a turn, it hit us hard. This show is about that - about what happens when the artist you idolize betrays you.

BWW: I appreciated how the description of your show addresses that beyond the rational and political reasons for someone to decide to boycott an Artist, there is also a very personal heartbreak and sense of betrayal when an Artist you admire and look up to does or says something hateful or harmful. Do the two of you remember the first time you discussed the sense of betrayal you felt from Kanye West in particular?

Zosky & Capital: Absolutely. The moment that stands out the most was when Kanye tweeted, “I’m going Deathcon 3 on Jewish people.” That was a gut punch.

Seth, as a Jewish artist, was devastated - not just by the tweet itself, but by the ripple effect it had. People were emboldened by it. Seeing “Kanye was right about the Jews” on flags being carried was surreal and terrifying. And for CJ, hearing Kanye claim that “slavery was a choice” felt like a deep betrayal to the Black community. We had both worshipped this man’s music, studied his production techniques, defended his artistry. Now, we had to ask ourselves: what do we do with this music that’s embedded in our lives?

That moment led to some of the most intense, honest conversations of our friendship. And, ultimately, it led to this show.

BWW: This idea of 'reclaiming' this music that you love is so brilliant. It's like the third option in the debate of "can you separate the Art from the Artist" that no one thought of! Do you remember the genesis of this idea? Was there a particular piece of music that you started with? Did you have the full concept of what your show would be in mind from the start, or did it happen more organically?

Zosky & Capital: Seth Zosky & Dan Petrenko (Director, Co-Creator) were having beers one night, and thought: “How wild would it be if you did a cabaret using Kanye West’s music?” The more we pondered on it, the more interesting it became. That is when Seth called CJ and asked him to be a part of it.

It was definitely an organic process. Since then, it has become much more than just a cabaret. We didn’t start with the idea of a full show - we started with confusion, frustration & a big timeline of our lives.

We’d throw on some of Kanye’s iconic hits and thought through the idea of what if we could take that feeling and put it into a performance? Not as a tribute, but as a protest.

We started experimenting with songs that had a personal connection and re-imagining them through the lens of betrayal, loss, and reclamation. We weren’t just singing Kanye’s songs; we were using them to tell our stories. That’s when the show really started to take shape.

The show confronts our new reality through theatre as we share real-life moments of celebration and heartache, love & loss – weaving together our own narratives of creative influence and evolution. We go deep – telling personal stories including adolescent memories, the genesis of our own friendship, and the birth of our creative partnership.

BWW: Do your complicated feelings about this Artist and the use of his music make this process easier or harder for you? (ie I'm sure the creative juices were flowing, but it also must be challenging to live in that place of internal conflict for a significant period of time).

Zosky & Capital: It’s both. The emotions fuel the creativity, but they also make it exhausting.

Every time we perform this show, we have to sit with the weight of our love for Kanye’s music and our disappointment in him as a person. It’s not easy to relive those feelings of betrayal night after night.

But there’s also something cathartic about it. By reshaping these songs, we’re taking control of the narrative. It’s a way of grieving, but also a way of fighting back.

BWW: Is there something in particular that you are hoping audiences will take away from this production?

Zosky & Capital: We want audiences to feel seen in their own conflicts.

Everyone has had that moment where someone they admire lets them down. Whether it’s an artist, a public figure, or even someone in their personal life - disillusionment is universal. This show is about what you do with that feeling.

It’s also about unity. Kanye’s rhetoric tried to divide communities - Black and Jewish, among others. But our friendship, our show, is proof that those bonds are stronger than hate.

We hope people leave feeling like they’re not alone in their struggles with art, identity, and betrayal. And, maybe, with a little more hope for the future.

BWW: Is there anything else you would like to share?

Zosky & Capital: Just that this show is deeply personal to us. It’s not just a concept - it’s our lived experience. And at the end of the day, it’s not about Kanye. It’s about resilience. About music as a way to process pain. About community.

PAIN TO POWER is a protest and a critical re-examination of the impact of a celebrity figure – whose art we both loved and bonded over but who eventually betrayed our values.

Ultimately – while it explores some complex, painful, and challenging themes like racism and antisemitism…the show is about LOVE, friendship, and is a celebration of life. It showcases that we can find strength in community during difficult times. It uses theatre to heal, foster dialogue, and turn pain into something meaningful.

Also, shoutout to our moms. Turns out they were right about Kanye all along.

PAIN TO POWER plays from March 25th to 27th at EL MOCAMBO in Toronto and before that, it plays at Montreal's Segal Centre on March 22nd and 23rd.

Tickets to the Toronto Performances are on sale now at elmocambo.com

Location: 464 Spadina Ave #462 Toronto, ON

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