Broadway Bullet Interview: The Jap Show's Comedians
By: Michael Gilboe Jun. 06, 2007
We talk to Cory Kahaney, the creator of The J.A.P. Show, and another comedian from the show, Jessica Kirson. They discuss the show, ethnic humor, and the emergence and cultural history of Jewish comedians.
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You can listen to this interview and many other great features for free on Broadway Bullet vol. 117.Subscribe for free so you don't miss an episode.
Broadway Bullet Interview: Cory Kahaney and Jessica Kirson of The JAP Show
BROADWAY BULLET: A tribute to comedians past and present, and a celebration of Jewish female comedians, The JAP Show is playing Off Broadway, and we are lucky to have with us: creator and comedian Cory Kahaney, and another comedian, Jessica Kirson, to talk about the show. How are you guys doing?
CORY KAHANEY: Good, how are you?
BB: Good. Now, I understand a lot of -- why you got the show together, was from a lot of agents and people telling you to take the Jewish out of your comedy.
CK: Years ago, when I was trying to get noticed by Hollywood, they said, "You've got to get rid of the Jew." You know, "Deliver me a Jew-free set and I'll take you to California," and I finally mastered that. And when I say "Jew-free," I just mean there was no Jewish references. I slanted it New York, and not Jewish. The doors really did open for me. The funny thing is: I got development deals, and people were very interested in me. There's only so much you can do to hide it, and it starts to bleed out of you like chicken fat, your Jewishness. And once they smelled it, they sent me packing back to New York. Really, the short end of the story is: the Jewish community has always really supported me – I've always performed for them, whether it was a Hadassah, or a country club, or a community center – and I thought, I'd like to create something for these people because, clearly, they are interested in what I have to say. That was the real gist of it.
BB: Now, the show mixes clips of past comedians, and, of course, the four of you: the two of you here, and then two other lovely comedians in the show. How did you go about organizing the show? How did you pick who you wanted to come into the show with you?
CK: Well, as far as the live comedians, I just went for the strongest comedians in New York City.
BB: And the dead ones? (laughs)
CK: And, well, in terms of the dead ones, it was painstaking. I spent an inordinate number of hours listening to recordings, and watching tapes day after day after day. It has hard because I'd find somebody's "A-bit," you know, a bit that was completely what they were famous for, but I couldn't put it in the show because it would be, like, a twenty-minute bit. Jean Carroll was one of the most incredible comedians, and she has a whole bit about buying a fur coat, but it's eighteen minutes. So it was really hard. I had to find everybody's best work; I had to find everybody's best two minutes. And, I mean, it was a no-brainer in terms of Belle Barth and PEarl Williams, because they were just, beyond hilarious, so they became one faction. And Betty Walker did characters, and I wanted somebody who did characters, and she was also very famous in her own right. And Jean Carroll was sort of the least-known, but to me, the absolute best comedian of all times. And Totie Fields was, you know, an original. She was just so hilarious. And these women really paved the way for other women to do stand-up. And what I thought was really interesting was: all of them were Jewish -- with the exception of Moms Mabley -- in this era. It was all Jewish women that were actually doing stand-up, in terms of -- for our gender taking to the stage, and grabbing the microphone, and telling jokes. And I thought, Wow, that's, that's something to be proud of, that we've always been encouraged, and invited and, allowed to be funny. And I thought that there's not much to be proud of in terms of being a Jewish woman, you know? But that's pretty cool.
BB: Jessica, at what point did you get involved with the show, and what was your process getting integrated in?
Jessica Kirson: Well, I work with Cory and the other comedians in the city, and I really respect Cory's work. And Cory and I -- she asked me to do it. And I started doing it, and I love working with her, and I love working with the other comics, and I think it's a great project, so I agreed to do it, because I won't do something if I really don't like it. I won't just take it just to take it, for the money or for the credit or whatever. You know, Cory works -- I do a lot of Jewish gigs, too, but not as many as Cory does, and she's a master at doing them. I mean, she's like -- every show, she just kills. And it took me a while to really learn how to work with that audience, because it's very specific.
BB: Now, there seems to be an explosion of, kind of, ethnic and religious-oriented comedians and humor, not just within the respective groups, but mainstream acceptance, I think, at least. Do you -- what's your sense of maybe why --
CK: Well, I think there's no question: Jews are hot; they're just really hot right now. "Entourage," last week, did a whole episode that included doing a business deal over Yom Kippur, which, I mean, Jessica and I could relate to that. We've seen that our whole lives. And Sarah Silverman is at the forefront, hosting all kinds of big, high-profile events. So, from where I'm sitting, it does seem like right now, the door is open, and they're very, very receptive to Jewish humor.
BB: See, I don't think it's just Jewish humor; I think the mainstream is opening up to all sorts of different cultural and family things. I think maybe even like -- I think My Big Fat Greek Wedding, actually, had a lot to do with exposing that a lot of these differences can be great points of fun to find out, but you still see the heart of what is similar about all of us, and it seems like you see a lot more things – not just Jewish, but a lot more cultural identity things popping up, whereas, I believe [the main character in My Big Fat Greek Wedding] was told: "Get rid of your Greek." (laughs)
CK: Yeah. Oh, absolutely; I agree with you, I second that. There's definitely a lot of encouragement for ethnic things. I just think -- I've noticed in the past six months, right now, everything Jewish is very hot. That's -- I mean, we have a Jewish rapper! You know, there's a Hassidic guy doing rap!
BB: Yes, Matisyahu [the Hassidic guy doing rap]. Is [The J.A.P Show] at all audience-interactive, like a typical comedy gig might be, or is it definitely more of a staged presentation?
CK: I'll let you take that one.
JK: Well, I work with the audience a lot, because I can't just perform to the audience. I really like to use the audience. So, it depends on the comic's style. And we've been playing a little more with the audience – it's been more fun. You know, like if they're not laughing, Cory'll be like, "Loosen up! Start the car!" Yeah.
CK: (laughs) But Jessica is a complete -- she does an enormous amount of crowd work. She's -- that's why we have her introduce Totie Fields to the audience, because Totie Fields did a ton of crowd work and that was -- [Totie] couldn't really do her act without having an audience. It would be boring as hell if you just stood there and did your act into a microphone.
JK: Well, that's funny, because I do that a lot, and it's fine.
CK: Just at home, into the microphone?
JK: Yeah, I mean, my cat's there --
CK: Yeah, okay, but I bet you involve the cat.
JK: The other day, she heckled me.
CK: Did she?
JK: Yeah, she went: (meowing, cat sounds)
BB: I'm curious, maybe, what are some of the funniest pieces that you let go from the show?
CK: There's a joke that I tried the other night that they wouldn't go for. Actually, Jessica helped me write the joke, because I have a three-year-old, and we're at the end stages of potty training. I have two sisters, I have two, -- a mother and a step-mother, I have a daughter – I've never been around boys. So, I said to Jessica, "I just feel like I'm touching it too much!" -- with this, you know, with the potty training, and she said, "Cory, if it's in your mouth, you're touching it too much." (laughter) So, I tried it on stage, and [the audience] hated it. It was just too -- I had crossed the line with the respectful Jewish audience.
JK: Yeah, and I do like, a ten-minute bit about Germany, and it doesn't work there.
CK: No. But Cathy Ladman talks a lot about Hitler, and they love it. It really depends on like, where you come from in the bit.
JK: Well, she makes it very funny.
CK: She makes it hilarious.
JK: She has very funny stuff. It's making fun of him, it's not, you know --
CK: Cathy does a whole bit about how she saw a documentary about Hitler and Eva Brawn, and supposedly, they had a great relationship. And she said, "Who was she dating before that, that made Hitler such a great guy? She's in couples counseling with her wonderful husband from Minnesota. But, you know what? He's no Hitler." And, I mean, it's very funny, and they go with it.
JK: [She] gets laughs; I don't.
CK: The Jews are the ones who tell the most Hitler jokes. You know the famous one, right? The guy goes into a bar, he sees a man at the end of the bar, and it looks exactly like Hitler. And he sits at the bar and he's looking, and he's looking, And finally, he can't take it anymore, and he goes over and he says, "Excuse me, are you Hitler?" And the guy says, "Yes." And [the first guy] says, "Oh my God, what are you doing here?" ["Hitler"] says, "Well, I'm back, and this tim,e I'm gonna get rid of all the Jews and all the chickens." And the [first guy's] like, "What's wrong with chickens?" [Hitler] goes, "See? Nobody gives a shit about the Jews!" (laughs)
BB: That's bad!
CK: But Jews -- I heard that at The Friar's Club, by a Jew!
JK: That's hysterical!
BB: It is -- I mean, it's -- unfortunately, it is. But I think [non-Jews] don't tell the jokes because,keven if we're not German, or had nothing to do over there, I still think there's this non-minority residual guilt, you know, that, you know --
JK: Oh, I think a lot of Jewish people tell jokes like that. That's, you know --
BB: But, it's kind of like, you know, the n-word, that Black people feel that they can use it, and, you know, us non-minorities are stuck in this whole like, minefield of like, what's okay, what's funny, what's not, whereas -- I actually think that's maybe one reason why some of the ethnic and minority humor is coming through, is because we don't know what's acceptable, and I think it's good to banish some of the demons of the past and some of the bad things with humor, but [non-minorities] are not the ones who can do that.
CK: Yeah, but you have to understand, there's a big distinction between a good joke, and something racist. What Michael Richards did on stage, by just saying the n-word over and over again, was not funny.
BB: No.
CK: The joke that I just told you -- okay, maybe it rubs people the wrong way, but you've gotta give it up, there's a punch line at the end. And so, I always give it up if there's a punch line at the end. Does that make sense? Because I respect the formula of the joke
BB: But you're a comedian, and you obviously appreciate --
CK: Yes.
BB: --the craft that goes into that joke.
CK. Yeah. I mean, Sarah Silverman is a case in point. She has a brilliant joke: she looks at the audience, and she goes, "I was raped by a doctor, which is so bittersweet for a Jewish girl." And a lot of people hate that joke, they don't care if -- "There should never be a joke about rape!" But it's hilarious! You know? It's hilarious. And it's also told from Sarah, who sets it up at the very beginning that she's -- let's put it this way, less-than Mother Teresa-like. She's had a lot of sex. So you don't really know if it was truly a rape, you know what I mean? What people walk away with is, "My God, as a culture, we really do have humor down." And I'm not taking it away from the Gentiles, because there are some very funny Gentiles. I can't think of any at this point --
JK: I also wanna say that what I love is that people walk away from the show saying, "Wow, women are truly funny." That's also part of it. They really see how funny women can be.
BB: A friend of mine, who has been lamenting the fact that she doesn't know enough funny girls -- she likes writing funny female parts – she just says she has a hard time finding women who are willing to look stupid.
CK: Well, in comedy, whenever they do write for a funny woman, she's usually a bimbo; it's usually a Pamela Anderson-type with big boobs, who's like, you know, very much -
JK: "Oh my God, like, that is so funny!"
CK: Yeah, but, or, it's just -- it's very much like the Gene Wilder thing, with Teri Garr. It's: "Oh, but you have such a big hot dog!" You know, "Are you happy to see me or is that a banana in your pocket?" I mean, they always give it to these beautiful women who -- are just dumb. I don't think -- (laughter) I don't think they see they see that women can be smart and kind of, I don't know, slobby.
BB: Well, the show sounds absolutely hysterical to watch. Now, there may actually be a few listeners out there who maybe need to -- do you wanna explain what the "JAP" part of The JAP Show means?
CK: It stands for "Jewish American Princess," and typically the history around Jewish American Princesses was: they were very spoiled and privileged and, you know, whiny, and it was a reputation that was -- and it was a label that was put on Jewish women. But the truth of the matter is: we don't look at it that way, we look at it as -- the women that paved the way for us were these incredible, iconoclastic, great comedians, and we're the daughters of their legacy. Because Jewish women were allowed to be funny, as a result of these women, so can we; and that's our birth right, and so we're claiming it, you know? Represent!
BB: And right now, The JAP Show is currently set for an open run, I understand?
CK: It's -- yeah, I think we're running through November at this point.
BB: So I always tell our listeners: don't let an open run be an excuse to wait.
CK: Absolutely.
BB: Never take advantage of something --
CK: And the good thing is, we have this terrific show on Sundays at 5:00, which is fantastic for the Jewish people -- or for the elderly.
JK: (in old, Jewish-woman voice) Because they have dinner at three!
CK: They have dinner at three, or they can go to dinner at seven, and this --
JK: (continues in same voice) No, it's the early bird, 3:00! They share a sandwich. They come in --
CK: They take home the rolls.
JK: (continues)Right. They take home everything on the table!
CK: That's right.
JK: (continues) And they say, "Wrap that up, it's for the help!"
CK: No, they say, "It's for later." These are the "for later" rolls, The "for later" danishes -- They can go to TheJAPShow.com or they can go to Telecharge and ask for The JAP Show.
BB: Well, Jessica and Cory, I thank you so much for coming down, and hacking for our listeners.
CK: You should live and be well.
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You can listen to this interview and many other great features for free on Broadway Bullet vol. 117.Subscribe for free so you don't miss an episode.
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