So are the men at Madison Square Garden more real?

[themysteriousgrowl]

Gav -- LOL at your fly-by reading. That's just great.

And absolutely. No matter what, as a piece of marketing, it's unwise, ill-conceived, and borderline stupid.

Sometimes, though, the gay community flies too quickly to outrage (!!!1!!) in instances where our energy might be better conserved for things that are flatly offensive. We are sometimes community that cries wolf, to our disadvantage.

That's not to say anyone genuinely offended by something should keep quiet. (I personally don't see this specific ad as out-and-out homophobic.) But even when I find myself immediately outraged by something, I do take a moment to reason it through and do a bit of rational thinking before I open my mouth and fly off the handle.

The same can be said of the current state of political discourse in this country, which, obviously, we see on these boards every day.

[canmark]

>>> And, umm, what about the people (yes, they do exist), who would want to see a sports game as much as they'd also want to see a show?

Yes, like ME. I would LOVE to see a Knicks game at the Garden, and I would LOVE to see a Broadway musical. (And, in fact, I was at a Toronto Raptors game last night and I plan to go see The Normal Heart next week. Sports and theatre are not all that different forms of entertainment.)

It does seem odd that the ad would knock something that New York is so famous for (Broadway), something that brings tourists to the city... and some of those same tourists will attend events at the Garden. Similarly, fans in town to see events at the Garden will also be attracted to theatrical events.

There does seem to be a suggestion that actors in musical theatre are not "real men" like professional athletes. But it's like someone saying "that's so gay" about a singing Spider-Man on stage... and that same guy lines up on the opening night of the Spider-Man movie. One is not any more manly than the other.

[strummergirl]

James Dolan and MSG serve to make every owner in the area look competent by comparison. The Steinbrenner bros., the Wilpons, Chalres Wang, and Woody Johnson should all send Dolan a fruit basket for his consistent debauchery of owning a team. Really, for a team with a NY brand and hat much payroll and cash flow they should have more than two rather fluky Eastern Conference championships since the 70s.

And if we really follow Knicks gossip along with facts, Stoudemire's more fragile than china and Anthony was jealous of Jeremy Lin's cult status. Yep, some real men there.

I agree with the question of what this ad is for. Most Knicks ticket holders are wealthy and likely see their share of Broadway shows like any other big ticket in town event.

[CukorLover]

One has to look no further than the photos of the men in Broadway Bares to see what real men they are.

[bjh2114]

I actually don't see it as a gay issue (though of course the undertones are there). I see it as an insult to the profession. It makes it sound like athletes wake up every day and go to WORK, practicing many long hours and playing many games to bring home the bacon, whereas actors show up to work, walk on to stage while goofing around, and then go home. It sounds like they underestimate the amount of work/practice/sweat that goes into a Broadway show and, as a result, end up undermining the performers themselves. What's hilarious though, is that the same amount of practice (if not more) goes into preparations for a Broadway show as for a sporting event. AND on top of that, athletes don't play every single day, and they CERTAINLY don't play 8 times a week. It's really just insulting to a lot of people by telling them that their career choice is illegitimate when in fact it's probably more taxing physically and financially than for most SEASONAL athletes. A terrible, misguided ad indeed.

[HeyMrMusic]

It's weird because I've always associated MSG with A Christmas Carol, which did feature real men (and women) in harnesses flying around the stage. Peter Pan also featured harnessed actors flying about. Maybe that's why Grinch will be playing there this season, because there is no harnessed flying?

[Princeton Returns]

Im with themysteriousgrowl

I just read it as you can see men really jumping without the aid of harnesses and special theatrical effects etc.

But in these easily offended and highly PC times where people/ the press will jump on anything, as a piece of marketing that can be read either way is a dumb idea

[EponineAmneris]

I LOVE sports. NFL (Steelers!!!) NHL (Penguins!!!) Tennis. The Olympics, Summer and Winter.

I have NEVER been a basketball/NBA fan.

This only makes me want to stay even farther away from it and the players.

[Phyllis Rogers Stone]

A very wise fried of mine said this about the video:

If they weren't trying to appeal to the "we hate sissies" crowd they would have worded it "You can either see a Broadway harness malfunction or you can watch men fly for real." But they didn't. On purpose.

[Gothampc]

My thought on the "real" men comment was that is was a swipe at Spiderman vs a real man.

The ad is really stupid because the Theatre at Madison Square Garden hosted Cirque de Soleil for a long time. So the flying comparison really isn't apt because harnesses were being used right underneath the sports arena. It would be the same as saying "Don't see Cirque de Soleil" at the Theatre, come upstairs and see us.

[GavestonPS]

In fairness, Phyllis, your friend's rewrite wouldn't fit on the poster. Whatever abbreviated version they chose was almost bound to invite "interpretation".

[Phyllis Rogers Stone]

You can either see a Broadway harness malfunction or watch men fly for real.

There. Now it would fit.

[GavestonPS]

Yeah, and it's so catchy, too, Phyllis! LOL.

[Phyllis Rogers Stone]

You are truly insufferable! LOL

[GavestonPS]

Have I actually annoyed you, Phyllis? I can't tell.

If so, it was inadvertent and I am sorry.

At the very least, the (actual) ad fails for a lack of cleverness.

[darquegk]

Count me in with the people saying this is not meant to be homophobic but came out wrong through shoddy wording.

It appears to me, when I gave it a close reading, that there is SUPPOSED to be an implied pun on "Spider-Man," (which you probably can't openly mock in an ad for slander/libel reasons) with the "Real Men" reference. But the pun doesn't play and what we get is the homophobic undertones instead.

[Amalia Balash]

Any time someone's trying to say they're a "real" man, woman, athlete, American, whatever and someone else isn't, they lose me.

Spider-Man requires athleticism in its actors; the NBA requires showmanship in its players. Theater and basketball both involve real people doing real jobs. It's all entertainment.

[EponineAmneris]

http://broadwayworld.com/article/Knicks-Pull-New-Ad-That-Claims-Broadway-Actors-Not-Real-Men-20121107

[americanboy99]

What a sad lapse in judgement.